Author Topic: stupid questions  (Read 6545 times)

Offline nwcatman

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stupid questions
« on: September 24, 2012, 02:19:05 PM »
hope this isn't too windy! i started making calls back in 2010 maybe did 15-20 (peppermills are my thing), had back surgey so stopped for awhile and wanna get back into it. my main question, i guess, is about sound boards and reeds. i have several on hand from HUT etc but really don't like the plasticky look of em. however, if thats what to go w/then so be it. i want to stick to predator/elk/turkey calls, mostly predator. are jigs to be had to make ur own? does it matter? i see tutorials here w/jigs but no where to buy/build one. does the consumer care? i have a nephew in colo. that is a professional bowhunter and writes for a magazine so i want to let him evaluate my stuff. eventually. but i DON'T wanna send him MY beginners crap. having said that i realize everyone (myself included) has to start somewhere. but you get what i mean. now that i'm retired i can devote a little more time to it than before. anyway.............ANY AND ALL suggestions appreciated. thanks
« Last Edit: September 24, 2012, 03:06:39 PM by nwcatman »
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Offline Jon @ JRwoods

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #1 on: September 24, 2012, 05:11:31 PM »
First I am NOT a predator call maker, but with call making I think some things are universal.
You have to get an understanding of what makes the call run.  If using plastic, pre made parts gets you there, great!  I think everyone has looked at a tone board and said " I wonder what happens when i file a little/ drill/ shorten/ etc right here.
if its like my duck calls the jig only gets you so close.  The fine tuning is done off jig by hand.  How close you get to that finished product depends on the jig.  I'm not familiar with predator tone boards but I assume a hardwood jig could be made to get you close, the finish file by hand. 
You can always start tweaking your HUT tone boards.  You are starting from someone else's finish, so you won't be able to put meat back on the bone.  But still a useful learning tool. 
There's quite a few talented predator call makers on here, I'm sure someone else will have more specific advice.
Formerly Highlooker.
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Offline dogcatcher

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #2 on: September 24, 2012, 05:58:53 PM »
Too many variables for open reeds for there to be one good jig.  Some people like long narrow reeds, others like short wide reeds, and the others like the million options in between.   Freehand cut the slope with a nice smooth curve is about the best advice you will find.  One start would be a public duck jig, Brian, BigB did a tutorial using one, that would be another starting point.   Then get out your file and find that magic spot.

Marvin
Combat Infantryman, the ultimate hunter where the prey shoots back.
Old style calls for today's outdoorsman
"Call and they will come."
Helping those that are helping themselves.

Offline nwcatman

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2012, 08:10:25 PM »
appreciate the replies guys. problem is ur talking about tweeking etc and i don't know the diff. between a tweeked and an untweeked call. i'm not a caller, i just like to make stuff. but........i'm sure when i send the nephew some of em he can get a good evaluation or two. how about the commercial stuff you buy at cabellas? i assume that stuff is mass produced and untweeked. right?
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Offline dogcatcher

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2012, 08:46:51 PM »
appreciate the replies guys. problem is ur talking about tweeking etc and i don't know the diff. between a tweeked and an untweeked call. i'm not a caller, i just like to make stuff. but........i'm sure when i send the nephew some of em he can get a good evaluation or two. how about the commercial stuff you buy at cabellas? i assume that stuff is mass produced and untweeked. right?

There will be people that will disagree with this, but overall the commercial calls sound as good as most "customs".  They both use the same reeds.  There is only one manufacture of the bulk of the reeds used in predator calls.  You can only do so many things to a reed that is approximately 1/4" wide and around .002 to .003 thick.  Sure you can blade them, but that weakens the reed, better to use a different internal design.  If you want a custom closed reed call you can change the insides and get different sounds, companies can do the same thing, except they have to get a new mold made to get the line out to the public.

Next why would a company spend  the money to have molds made to make a call that doesn't sound good.  A good mold starts at about $10,000 for professional injection molding.  Those designs were tested and tested again before they spent that kind of money.  Fit and finish, in most cases customs will win hands down, but sometimes even some of the customs also leave a little to be desired. 

My 2 cents if I were you I would first I would get with the nephew.  Learn everything he knows about the calls you want to make.  Ask him what he wants the call to do and TAKE NOTES while you are listening.  Watch some You Tubes about predator hunting, find out how other hunters use their calls.  Buy some commercial calls, look on ebay, find some cheap "customs, old calls and whatever lights your fire.  Buy a handful of different reeds, switch out the reeds in the calls you have acquired to see what changes what from one call design to another.  During this time keep taking NOTES. 

Now you are about ready to start turning calls, take measurements of the calls, change a little here and little there.  See what happens to the sound, and TAKE NOTES.   On the JC reed calls there are 3 places, the mouth opening, the reed holder and the exhaust, the combination of changes is unlimited.  To start forget about pretty, go for the sound.  Pretty calls can call in animals, but poor sound works against the hunter.

Good luck.

Marvin
Combat Infantryman, the ultimate hunter where the prey shoots back.
Old style calls for today's outdoorsman
"Call and they will come."
Helping those that are helping themselves.

Offline nwcatman

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #5 on: September 24, 2012, 09:09:32 PM »
beautiful response. thanks for the infor. and time!! got a lot to think about/research.
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Offline Rick Howard

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2012, 12:22:37 AM »
Marvin has been making calls for a lot longer than I have.  I am inclined to agree with what he says.

I would add that if you spend some time learning how to use and open reed call that it will pay off in making your own.  Tuning (tweaking) the call will be much easier if you know how to run it.  I wont say it is impossible to do it without being proficient but, probably close.  You do not need to be an expert caller but, you should be able to run a call without difficulty.

Making your own toneboard is more rewarding.  Start making a few and you will get the hang of it pretty quick.  (No jig needed)  I think buying a few calls, custom and production, is a good idea.  Pay close attention to the similarities and the differences in them.  Pay close attention to what you like and dislike in each call.

Do some researching, learn by trial and error, and keep asking questions. <--- It helps keep our gears running too.           

     
In life or anything worth partaking, if you have stopped trying to improve you have quit.

Offline nwcatman

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2012, 05:42:46 PM »
wow....cool. thanks. gonna read all this more than once. or twice. what i asked for and wanted to hear.
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Offline Wane

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2012, 08:58:13 PM »
My brother and I hunt together a lot and use the calls I make, I have my way to blow them and he has his way which sounds way different than mine on the same call and they both work to call dogs in.
Wane

Offline nwcatman

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2012, 02:37:35 PM »
again..........i appreciate all the responses and advice. i think! lotta infor. to digest. i am an avid reloader and have been since the 60's . i have a conservative estimate of $5G worth of loading gear, and keep SINCLAIR in business. when i talk about loads, guns etc w/most guys and they ask a question and i answer it i usually get a look that says "huh"? point is, the situation is now reversed and i'm going "huh" to a lot of the call making stuff. such as.........i just got a flyer from MIDWAY and they have, ON SALE, calls from $99-$159, and they are obviously mass produced tupperware. WHY?? what the..??
went to the link AL sent in his reply and am having a lot of fun reading all of that, so thanks. someday i hope to be able to absorb all that and put it to use. just cranked up the lathe after a 2 year hiatus so maybe after some practice i will go cut a limb off a mesquite tree and get a call made. eventually. 
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Offline nwcatman

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2012, 04:51:33 PM »
and another question (how many do i get b4 i'm banned, anyway).
i have had the book TURNING CUSTOM DUCK and GAME CALLS by Glenn and Keats for awhile now. are there others to be had? any recommendations?
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Offline Wane

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2012, 07:34:15 PM »
I have found this site more up to date and more informative than any of the turning books I have read and it is more interactive. There is so much info on here you probably wright a couple of call making books. Just use the search and you find a gold mine of info on most call making and if you don't find it ask the question and some will point you in the right direction. This place has helped me improve all of my turning not just calls, these guys are great.
Wane

Offline nwcatman

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #12 on: October 01, 2012, 07:48:06 AM »
wane...no question about about all the help on this site!   :beer:

has anyone ever (maybe i just missed it) posted an illustration of just how a call works mechanically as the air is blown in at the mouthpiece and thru the call and out the exhaust? picture a weatherman on TV in front of a map that has arrows showing the winds blowing and creating highs and lows. maybe showing how the air flows differently over different reeds, soundboards, etc etc explaining how it all fits together to produce diff. sounds/options. would help call dummies like me understand the theory of it all a little better. not that its that complicated, but lots of variables to absorb.
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Offline nwcatman

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #13 on: October 01, 2012, 05:40:39 PM »
no replies. guess i DID hit my dumb question limit!
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Offline nwcatman

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Re: stupid questions
« Reply #14 on: October 01, 2012, 08:19:58 PM »
naw, i'm not angling for any market at all except that i wanna do it right. any calls i make will be given away to the nephew. like i said, my thing is peppermills. i just want the user to look at it/use it and be impressed a little, not be amused. i guess i'm old school in that whatever i do i wanna do right. thats all. i'm not after anyones livliehood. i'm newly retired and WANNA HAVE SOME FUN.   :hunter1:
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