Bands Staining Question

[Kirk Malmo]

I've been making calls for a few months now. I have been trying several different looks and strategies toward call making so that I can get a general knowledge of what might work best for me.

Currently I turn the tenon, press my band on, and then finish the rest of the call, including all the sanding. I have been using silver bands (I think stainless?) I got them from Rivermallard and have been happy so far. When I sand and polish the call and/or band I always seem to get a dark metallic powder that stains my calls. It appears very hard to correct and gets worse when wet sanding. I have been working with Honey Locust sapwood (another set of questions on that coming soon). It is very light/ yellowish so a dark unintentional stain can really ruin a call.

Attached is a picture of what I am talking about. It was worse, but I have sanded the call down more trying to take the stain out. Notice the dark areas toward the band that have leeched into the grain. The barrel pictured here is HL sapwood with one coat 50/50 dip in spar/mineral spirits and unfinished and unsandeded. First post, hopefully this photo works correctly.



So my question, how do I avoid this staining? I believe brass would not cause the same problem (at least same color stain), but I like the look of some silver bands. Should I be dipping in spar first before even pressing the band on? Thanks in advance for the help. This forum has been a major help toward making my first full barrel and insert.

[James Strickland]

Couple things here.  I haven't tried it, but I believe I've read before that wiping the call down with acetone will help clean the metal dust off of the wood. 

Another suggestion... sand toward the band so that you don't drag metal dust onto the wood.  And use a clean piece of sandpaper for each pass.  I do this when I've laminated different woods together.  I'll sand from light wood toward the dark wood to avoid "staining" the lighter wood with the dark wood dust.

Also, my personal approach for spar dipping calls (I'm assuming you're dipping in spar) is to put the band on after the finish is applied.  This would also eliminate the issue of metal dust staining the wood since the band won't be on the call when you sand.

[Kirk Malmo]

Thank you for the ideas. I'll try the acetone to see if it works. I've been meaning to pick some up to see if it helps with dipping bocote in spar.

I've tried sanding toward the band. When dry sanding that works to some degree, but it becomes very difficult to sand thorough enough near the band. For instance in the picture I added, thoroughly sanding the lanyard groove next to the band is near impossible without getting some of this metal dust mixed in with the wood.

I will try putting the band on after one or two dips in spar next time. I'm scared that the pressure needed to press the band on will destroy part of the finish. I could dip more coats after putting on the band but that may not turn out as planned, especially if the finish has chipped. I simply press my band on while the barrel is on my mandrel. I turn the tenon down and then use my tailstock to evenly apply plenty of pressure to push the band onto the tenon. I am trying this without glue or pins (we will see how it holds up with lots of abuse and wet conditions).

I guess there is no way to know if all this works until I try it out. Thank you for the info and the head start on getting my problem fixed.

[B Hoover]

Kirk, I would definitely epoxy or pin the bands on.  Duck calls are exposed to a wide range of temps (heated truck to below zero temps in minutes).  The band will more than likely come off without an epoxy of some type.  I turn grooves in the wood where the band will be placed.   This gives the epoxy something to grab on to.  Also, rough up the inside of your bands.  I use a Dremel to cut small divots into the inside of the band; cut at an angle.

James was spot on about the sanding.  I would finish the call and then apply the band.

[LagrueCustomCalls]

Dumb question, but you're not wet sanding the bare wood are you?

On the bands and fixing them in place , I can almost 100% guarantee that a pressed on band will come off eventually on a wood call.

When I started callmaking, I used an old process that many old style makers used- you would turn your band tenon long, and with a taper that would allow you to hand press (hard) the band on to the end. You would then spin the lathe fast and hold emery cloth against the band to cause it to heat up and expand. When it expanded, you would tap it into place on the slightly oversized area. After cooling it would be very tight on hardwoods.

Unfortunately, some of those call makers call bands (and some of those that I made using that method 20+ yrs ago) have come off. Even the best dried woods will change over time, resulting in the wood pulling away from the band and the band falling off.