Author Topic: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....  (Read 5782 times)

Offline gooseforsupper

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Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« on: April 01, 2012, 11:23:37 PM »
Hi Gang!  :up1:

This is part 1 of building a laminated goose flute,  the glue-up.

First I wish to that those special people that have helped me along the way, Ed Glenn, Billy Hayes, Joe Kolter, Wade Carpenter, and all of you here on the forum who share your expertise and friendship.  Without all your help I would still be making bowls... :beer:

So here goes:

The blank pieces, all numbered as they are cut off off the block, so I can match up the grain. Zebrawood and Claro Walnut Burl.  General dimensions are 3 1/2 inches for the barrel, and 6 inches for the exhaust.


I drill the two big blanks on the lathe, 5/8 inch all the way through.



My vice set up for drilling the thin blocks, with sacrificial wood to drill into and avoid tearout..



My homemade internal bore sander.  Just a 1/4 inch bolt with a slot cut in the end, chucked up in a #2 morse taper drill chuck.  It is critical to go back and open up the bores on all the pieces so they fit very loosely during the glue-up as you will see.




5/8 inch steel rods used for the glue-up.  I put them in my collet chuck and then sanded them down to around .610 so the slide easily through the bore.  I made up a half a dozen of them from 4 to 7 inches long for multiple glue-ups.  They are waxed so that the glue will not stick to them.


Lining up and matching the grain is critical, and here is how I go about it.  Draw a line with pencil on the blank face across the grain and mark the outsides of the blank.  This way you can line up everything during the glue-up and on the lathe later on.


Now TEST FIT the blanks on the metal rods.  They should fit against each other flush without binding on the metal rods.  If they do not, go back to the internal bore sander and open them up more until they have some wiggle room when on the rods.  Check the grain of the pieces so you are sure you have them lined up correctly and write on the sides if you need to keep it straight during the rush of the glue-up.

Then the glue-up.

Apply a thin coat of glue to all surfaces, quickly.  Slide on the first two pieces, line up the grain lines and twist them together back and forth slightly until the glue starts to tack up and "stick" in place.  Then slide on the third piece and do the same.  Get them lined up and hold them firmly until they tack in place, a couple of minutes sometimes....  You don't want them moving when you apply pressure with the clamps.  Then clamp two opposite sides and tighten the clamps, then the other two clamps.  I clamp them pretty tight, squeezing out most of the glue, because thin glue lines are the strongest... :pot:




After the glue has set for a couple of hours you can go back and drive the metal rods out of the blocks.  I have a 3/4 inch hole in my workbench and I place the rod over the hole, take another rod and drive it out of the blank with a rubber hammer.  Don't let the rods stay in the blanks until the glue is completly set or you will have a very hard time getting them out of the blanks, trust me I've been there.... :stickman1:

Once the glue has cured for 24 hours or so, go back and sand with the internal bore sander and clean up all the glue on the inside of the bore.   

In Part 2, I will turn the call all as one piece, using sacrificial wood on each end and a custom Webfoot Crush Lock flute mandrel.



It's all in the technique folks, it's not rocket science, just pay attention to detail and it works out.... :punk:

All The Best!   :bigup:

Doug 

« Last Edit: April 02, 2012, 08:16:04 PM by gooseforsupper »

Offline VECtor Calls

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2012, 12:19:50 AM »
WOW MAN!  OUTSTANDING WRITEUP!  I really like it!  Thanks goose!

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Offline Callen

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2012, 08:46:01 AM »
Awesome write-up.  I'm sure it will help a lot of people out.   :bigup:

Another thing people can do if they do not have that many clamps for the glue up, is to use a 5/8'' (or whatever size your bore is) bolt with a large washer on each end of the blank and just tighten the nut snug to "clamp" it. 
-Cody

Offline Joe aka COLD @ J. A. Kolter Calls

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2012, 07:53:18 PM »
Hey thanks for the for the acknowledgement.  Looks like your wanting to learn the tricks needed to laminate a few blocks.  From what I see you have done I'd like to comment to help you if I can.  Looks like you are overworking what you want to accomplish.  To make things easier and to save a bunch of time here's what I do gluing up flat end grain to end grain pieces.
I just make accurate square crosscut cuts for the pieces.  The pieces cut are also square to start.  This is important to have square tight fitting joints.
I then keep them with the grain aligned, marking with a pencil like you have done.  I then glue them together before they are bored out.  I use Titebond III, but Elmer's Probond works as well.  I lay them on wax paper after glue application to all joint sides to make any needed alignments before clamping working quickly.  I then use only one bar clamp to hold them together.  The glue will start to set immediately, and as this happens you can still align the pieces.  When you can barely move the joints anymore, you then clamp a bit tighter to move more glue out from the joints.
Do not over clamp too tightly.  I then remove the clamps in about one half an hour.  Most of what I glue is unclamped somewhere between 25 minutes to 45 minutes.  Never let them clamped overnight.
The following day (about 24 hrs. later) the glue joints should be cured well.  The actual joints will be stronger than the woods used in most cases when gluing wood to wood.  You can then bore the blocks out, 45 cut the corners off, and turn them.
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Offline gooseforsupper

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2012, 08:30:58 PM »
Thanks guys!  That's what I love about this forum,  lots of good stuff going on.   :stuart:

Joe, your right, I am overworking it.   :hammer: :pot:  I guess it comes from the fancy laminated segment calls I build and I just got in the habit of glueing up like that.  So, if you ever glue up a segmented call, the steel rod technique is how you do it.  Otherwise, Joe's method is faster and you get the same results in the end.... :punk:

If it wasn't for the national title basketball game coming up in a half an hour, I would get busy typing up Part 2 of this tutorial.  LOL!

Doug

Offline jcz

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2012, 08:35:10 PM »
You can type and watch the game at the same time.   :hysterical:

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Offline Ron Davis

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2012, 09:41:34 PM »
This is awsome stuff    Thanks Doug cant wait to put some of this to work

Ron

 

Offline HuntnCarve

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2012, 08:39:22 AM »
An excellent tutorial Goose, loaded with valuable information that folks will appreciate.  Well done!
A couple words for some of the newer and older laminators.  You can never over clamp a glue up in regards to time.  It’s better to give it too much time, than not enough.  Factors such as wood and shop temperature play into the equation.  Here you want to be above 60 F minimum.  Preferably in the 70-80F range. Wood moisture content can also enter into the picture if it’s excessively high/low.  In thousands of hours of glue testing it’s been found that at about 4 hours, at optimum gluing temperatures, a PVA based adhesive has sort of obtained its ultimate strength.  There’s a lot going on the glue line at that time.  The film formation is taking place as plasticizers and water are migrating out of the system.   Polymer chains are becoming entangled in what is known as “cross linking” as the drying adhesive forms into a hardened film.  During this time it is better not to disturb the bond by releasing clamping pressure prematurely.  That being said.  Can you take a glue up out of the clamps in short time periods?  Yes, it can be done, and the pieces will typically hold.  But why risk all the work done before hand to prepare the joints for the sake of saving a few minutes?
Lightly coating the steel rod with wax is also a very good idea for two reasons.  The first as you pointed out is to prevent the adhesive from sticking to it.  The second is that it provides a slight barrier against discoloration from an “iron tannate” reaction.  –We’ve all seen the black colored markings, and black squeeze out where the glue came in contact with metal clamps.  That’s the acidic adhesive reacting with iron (from an outside source, Ex. Clamp, bolts, etc), and tannic acid (found in most hardwood species).  So pay attention when iron containing materials are brought into the equation.
Once again, a very well presented tutorial.  Thank you for taking the time to share it with everyone.

HuntnCarve
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Offline James Strickland

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2017, 04:40:46 PM »
Uh oh... Looks like the links to the pics are no good anymore.  Or maybe it's my computer???

Offline gooseforsupper

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #9 on: June 17, 2017, 08:08:49 AM »
Hi James!  No, it's my computer.  Lost some files.  Sorry!

Offline Randy Byrd

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Re: Laminated Goose Flute Tutorial, Part 1 The Glue-Up.....
« Reply #10 on: June 17, 2017, 02:08:50 PM »
Thank You for this tutorial! It's awesome! I always appreciate your willingness to help others!  :bigup:
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