Author Topic: Long Reed Insert?  (Read 7325 times)

Offline lazyMlazyK

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Long Reed Insert?
« on: August 15, 2011, 10:22:22 PM »
It seems to me all the calls I've seen on here have a set of short reed guts in them.  Does anybody make any long reed goose calls here?  I'm thinking about giving it a try soon (my brother-in-law wants me to make him a cocobolo long reed call).  Also, I cannot get any low end out of my echo guts.  Is there any to be had?  No matter how I tune it, I cannot find any low end in them.  Tips?
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Offline Jon @ JRwoods

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #1 on: August 16, 2011, 12:13:54 AM »
Not sure on echos, have you tried another reed?  Shape of reed has a little to do with it.  Make sure the natural bend is up. 
Can't help with the long reed but I'm interested also.
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Offline Aaron at Wingerts Woodworks

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #2 on: August 16, 2011, 10:30:17 AM »
Can't speak to a "long reed" goose call, as I haven't heard of that.  I'm no goose call expert at all but I only know of flutes and short reeds. 

Not being able to get a good low end on your Echo guts could be due to the configuration of the barrel or insert.  Have you tried various bore diameters and step drilling the internal dimensions differently from barrel to barrel?  Exhaust lengths and diameters?  Echo guts will run, but you're probably going to have to focus on the call itself once you have your guts set right. 

Offline VECtor Calls

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2011, 10:46:46 AM »
I don't have any problem getting all kinds of tones out of ECHO guts.  I don't know how much experience you have with short reed goose calls, but they don't run with just air.  There is a lot of hand work that goes into a goose call reaching all different types of notes and tones.

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Offline crowkiller

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2011, 11:23:48 AM »
Most of my goose calls are long reed. What do you want to know?
  But they are all 4 piece inserts. Most guys shy away from 4 piece inserts for some reason.
 

Offline lazyMlazyK

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2011, 12:28:36 PM »
Crowkiller, could I see some pictures of your long reed inserts?  What makes them any different from, say, a coyote howler toneboard?
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Offline Aaron at Wingerts Woodworks

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2011, 03:43:30 PM »
Looking forward to learning something I didn't know about goose calls and long reed setups!  I can't even begin to picture a 4 piece reed/toneboard setup so I'm definitely curious! 

Offline Joe aka COLD @ J. A. Kolter Calls

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #7 on: August 17, 2011, 10:56:02 AM »
Looking forward to learning something I didn't know about goose calls and long reed setups!  I can't even begin to picture a 4 piece reed/toneboard setup so I'm definitely curious! 
Basic long-reed goose call toneboard and wedge, also commonly called a conventional goose call.
I usually make a few of these yearly.  The custom milled 1/2" toneboards are ran through a shaper using a 3-wing 1/4" cutter.  A four piece set-up can consist of a thin wall .500 brass tube recessed into goose insert to prevent split out or in this case a friction fit toneboard, wedge, mylar reed with a
o-ring set-up.  I also use 1/2" retainer rings in some cases to prevent wedge misaligment.
Here's a custom Koa Classic model showing the gut set-up.
 
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Offline Aaron at Wingerts Woodworks

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2011, 05:14:42 PM »
Thanks Joe.  I'd have never guessed that is a goose call from looking at just the toneboard and reed setup.  Shows the depth of my knowledge on goose calls, huh?!?!?!  Really neat looking call (and wood), that is for sure. 

Offline lazyMlazyK

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #9 on: August 17, 2011, 05:44:49 PM »
Thanks for that picture COLD  :clap: Any way we could twist your arm to get a close-up or two of the toneboard/reed setup?
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Offline Joe aka COLD @ J. A. Kolter Calls

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #10 on: August 17, 2011, 07:46:05 PM »
Thanks for that picture COLD  :clap: Any way we could twist your arm to get a close-up or two of the toneboard/reed setup?
Yes, give me a little time as I'm moving a little slow from surgery yesterday.  I can show a pic of a loose walnut one with reed sitting on my bench.  I can then give a quick description of what's what and the basics of making a conventional goose call using this gut system. 
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Offline crowkiller

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #11 on: August 17, 2011, 08:02:56 PM »
Well there you have it.
 Thanks joe for posting a pic.
Mine is slightly different but close enough.
 Joe that is a beautiful call.

Offline VECtor Calls

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #12 on: August 17, 2011, 10:19:17 PM »
 :up1:  Thanks for the picture COLD!  I'm looking forward to your further descriptions.  Its always cool to see all the different gut configurations that can make a goose call!

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Offline Joe aka COLD @ J. A. Kolter Calls

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2011, 11:07:11 AM »
Here's a pic of the conventional long-reed goose call with parts.  The barrel finished size is 3.75" long with a step bore of 3/4" reduced to 5/8" at the mouthpiece end.  The insert finished size is 3.5" long with a straight 1/2" bore with step 17/32" bore at toneboard end.  To prevent split-out on the 3/4" insert end a 1/2" piece of thinwall 17/32" brass with 1/2" ID is glued in.  Most of mine I skip the brass sleeve and trust the wood I'm using will not split.  You can use a 1/2" external retainer ring or o-ring to hold the tuned position. The insert gut is 1/2" dowel stock 2 1/8" in length with a 1/4" slot cut milled by a 3 wing cutter.  The ramp is set approximately 3/8" to 1/2" at various angles for tuning.  The reed can be .010 or .014 mylar type A.  It is tapered narrow and dogeared.  Unlike the short-reed the reed extends approximately 5/8" past the hole slot in the ramp.
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Offline lazyMlazyK

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Re: Long Reed Insert?
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2011, 12:17:07 PM »
WOW!  :bow:  :bow:  :2up: What an upstanding guy!  Thank you very much for unselfishly providing us with such detailed information!!  When I dive into this project, I'll have a LOT better chances of success now with all that you've offered here!  Thanks again!!!  :bigup:  :bigup:
http://kmcalls.webs.com/

‘‘To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them...’’

— Richard Henry Lee, 1787